Page 39 from: May 2013
39May 2013
we can consume, like food and construction
materials, represent what I call “biological
nutrients” and may re-enter the environment.
On the other side, we have technical nutrients
such as washing machines, which remain with-
in closed-loop industrial cycles. In this sense,
there is a bio-sphere and a techno-sphere.’
How have you successfully ‘marketed’
your philosophy?
‘I have to admit that I am not good at market-
ing at all. I’m a scientist, so that’s not my area.
In a way I am lucky because I can rely on Bill
McDonough, my best friend and partner on
the cradle-to-cradle project. He is such a great
speaker and someone who is very talented at
expressing himself in exactly the right words.
Bill deserves a lot of credit because he has man-
aged to mobilise the design community as well.
Over the years, both of us have seen the cradle-
to-cradle idea gain in popularity. What helped
was that we had a long series of talks and work-
shops with the Ellen MacArthur Foundation in
the UK. The platform for the concept grew
stronger due to McKinsey (the Swedish analyst)
providing over 500 training sessions on the
subject. This shows that we have also reached
key management consulting companies.’
How widespread has the cradle-to-
cradle concept become?
‘It has spread to many corners of the world,
ranging from Europe to Taiwan. The fact that
my book has thus far sold 15 million copies tells
me that people have realised recycling isn’t a
small problem but a global matter that concerns
everyone. To me, the concept is common sense,
really. I feel like the industry has finally discov-
ered that the world is not actually flat. You can’t
go back from that; you can only go forward.’
You’ve also received a lot of support
from A-list celebrities, right?
‘It is true that some celebrities have picked up
on the concept, like Arnold Schwarzenegger,
for example. But he’s not the only one: Meryl
Streep, Cameron Diaz and Brad Pitt have also
stated that they admire the concept. Brad Pitt
has even said that my book is one of the top
three most important books he’s ever read in
his life. He is using his position at the Make It
Right Foundation to award US$ 250 000 to a
company that can come up with the best cradle-
to-cradle innovation this year. To be honest, the
wide and eager support comes as a bit of a sur-
prise to me. I had expected that it would take
us at least a hundred years to succeed!’
Could you give a concrete example
of successful implementation of the
cradle-to-cradle concept?
‘The list of current applications is virtually end-
less. Take companies like European textiles
manufacturer Desso, for example. This industry
leader has gone completely cradle to cradle. This
decision has allowed them to increase their mar-
ket share from 16% to 24% in just two years,
rendering them the most profitable carpet sup-
plier in Europe. As a consequence, you are no
longer selling the carpet; you are selling the use
of the carpet. Basically, the company turns into
a materials bank. This means companies are
using the best materials they can instead of
thinking cheap. I call this smart materials use.’
And could you relate this thinking to
the average household?
‘We recently found out that any modern television
set includes 4360 different chemicals. Now I ask
you, do you want to own 4360 types of chemical
or do you want to watch television? Or I might
ask, do you want to own a car or do you want the
freedom to go from A to B? Most people will say
the latter. This is a big shift from where we were
in the 1980s when ownership was like a religion.’
Is cradle-to-cradle an economically
feasible concept?
‘Sure, because pursuing such a concept only
makes sense if it, in fact, makes sense for our
economy, right? To put it briefly, it is extremely
profitable and, more importantly, people have
come to understand that quality is worth investing
in. I believe our success comes from the fact that
we allow the industry to create far better products.
Sadly, one of the main obstacles is Germany
owing to its huge role in supporting incinera-
tion. I really don’t understand why they still
prefer to burn recyclables on such a big scale; it
means you lose all the material forever. At
the moment, the country is producing more
waste than their incinerators can burn. What’s
worse, the nation has become an example
for other nations in Europe. The motto nowa-
days seems to be “See you later, incinerator”!’
On your website, you state: ‘We do not
want sustainability; we want real qual-
ity.’ What exactly do you mean by this?
‘The way I see it, industrial or commercial
progress is not based on efficiency. Sure, today,
more and more people try hard to be more effi-
cient, but the word itself is misleading. Efficiency
is not enough; it is the bare minimum. We should
invest in effectiveness. After all, when we do eve-
rything to make the wrong things perfect, all we
do is make them perfectly wrong. How does that
help us? At the end of the day, I really don’t think
that being alive means minimising the damage.
It’s like saying “Sorry I am alive” in the first place.
We recently thought of an alternative for Uni-
lever’s ice cream packaging. What’s special about
the cradle-to-cradle solution is that the packaging
in question will degrade entirely two hours after
being taken out of the freezer. Unilever has been
trying to reduce the impact of ice cream packag-
ing on the environment for 31 years. Although
the company managed to reduce the footprint
by roughly 1% a year, this didn’t have the desired
effect because they were selling five times more
ice cream as well. The initial mistake was that the
company was essentially trying to be less bad.’
If the cradle-to-cradle concept were
implemented on a global scale, what
would be the most notable benefits?
‘With this concept, even smaller companies can
be extremely profitable – and they don’t have
to rely on the cheapest material to do so. What
makes the difference is that the success of cradle
to cradle is not based on scale, like it is nor-
mally. This gives smaller players a chance to get
involved with recycling too.’
What does cradle-to-cradle ultimately
mean to you personally?
‘In the end, cradle-to-cradle is about upcycling,
not about being green because, ironically, the
green pigment that can be used to create beer cans
and bottles is the most toxic pigment there is.
Therefore, there is no green that is ‘green’. Also, my
concept doesn’t say ‘one size fits all’. Cradle-to-
cradle is a flexible concept that allows people to
present their own unique interpretation.’
‘According to my
theory, there is no
waste any more.’
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